Alright, so here’s a question for everyone:  What defines lesbian fiction?

For the month of December, I teamed up with three other lesbian writers (two of us with full-length novels already published; one of us published in a few literary journals; the last of us an aspiring novelist) who promised to write every day and hold each other accountable. Each day, we’ve been posting little snippets of our work to prove that we wrote at least a little something that day.

The aspiring novelist posted her first-ever sex scene.  That led to a side-conversation about how much we all hate writing sex scenes.  THAT led to another side conversation about how you can’t really avoid writing sex scenes if you write in the lesfic genre.

One of us writes mysteries with lesbian detective protagonists, and she said that in one of her early books, she had only one fade-to-black sex scene.  Guess what?  Her readers were incensed.  In another book, her two lead detectives were on opposite sides of the country through the whole story, so they never had sex.  That also incensed her readers.

Readers let her know:  If there’s no (explicit) sex, then it’s just not lesfic.

The problem for the writer is that the “mainstream” mystery genre rarely includes explicit sex scenes.

(* I put “mainstream” in quotes because it bothers me that “mainstream” automatically means “straight,” and LGBTQ+ automatically means “outside the mainstream.”  Excuse me?  I’m a mainstream person.  I have a job, I pay my bills, I worry about the cost of health insurance, I binge watch Netflix.  Why am I “outside the mainstream” just because I’m queer?  But anyway.)

But if you leave explicit sex out of a book that you’re putting into lesbian categories, your readers will NOT be happy.  Hell, my first book only had 2.5 sex scenes (two explicit and one fade-to-black) and had people complain that it wasn’t enough!  I learned my lesson:  I always aim for at least three explicit scenes in each book.  That seems to chill people out.

But why do I have to include explicit scenes at all if I’m not writing romance?

When I wrote Princess of Dorsa, I included my standard three explicit sex scenes.

Here’s the problem:  PoD is an epic fantasy novel, and epic fantasy novels, like my friend’s mysteries, do not usually include explicit sex.  They usually include fade-to-black sex or else no sex at all.  The romance between the lead characters isn’t typically at the center of the story.  In fact, in PoD, I would say the romance is a subplot.

Readers of lesfic come to a book expecting explicit sex.

Readers of fantasy come to a book expecting fade-to-black sex.

That leads to reviews like this one:

As said above, there are explicit sex scenes in the book. I wasn’t… especially fond of them, but they didn’t take away from how phenomenally well written the book itself was elsewhere, nor were they the sole purpose of the book – it has a well written, solid story with a twist that I wasn’t expecting near the end. A fantastic read, if you don’t mind the lewdness.

– Amazon reviewer

I’m not saying the reviewer above was necessarily straight and feels grossed out reading about lesbian sex.  For all I know, they were a lesbian who only ever reads fantasy books with straight characters and they are therefore more accustomed to fade-to-black in a book.

So what’s an author who wants to satisfy everyone to do?

The trouble with writing a cross-over, and back to my original question

When I wrote PoD, I was hoping to attract two kinds of readers:  queer women who read fantasy and are hungry for characters who look/feel like them, and straight readers who read fantasy and don’t mind LGBTQ leads as long as it’s a good story.

As far as I can tell, about 95% of the readers fall into the first category, and just a handful fall into the second.  To be honest, I could probably attract more readers from the second category if I switched from explicit sex to fade-to-black sex.  But it’s not worth risking upsetting my core audience.

There *are* queer authors who succeeded in capturing more of the second category.  One of the inspirations for PoD was Huntress by Malinda Lo, which is definitely a high fantasy and definitely queer.  Huntress is sold as YA, so there’s nothing explicit in it.  However, I also get the feeling that even  if it had been written for adults, explicit lesbian sex scenes never would’ve allowed Huntress to be published by a Big New York Publishing House.

This brings me back to my original question — and a hypothesis.

My hypothesis is that queer women are hungry to see themselves represented in fiction — I know I am.  And where queer characters are relatively rare in the mainstream, queer sex is even more rare.

Although not as rare as it used to be.  Think about Sense 8, where the first time we meet the MTF+F couple, they’re in the middle of having strap-on sex.  And I’m guessing OITNB includes explicit f/f scenes?

Nevertheless, queer people still want to be able to see/read explicit sex amongst “our own kind,” given that we are constantly inundated in shows and movies that feature breeder sex.  

Ewww.

I mean, I love HBO’s take on Game of Thrones, but it’s practically soft porn!

But will we ever get to a point where readers of lesfic will tolerate books in their genre that *don’t* have explicit sex?  Am I going to be stuck the rest of my writing career saying to myself, “*sigh*, time to include another sex scene…”?

We’re here, we’re queer.  Will you ever get used to it?

Oh, and just one last point. 

Going back to GoT for a second:  To all my straight readers out there, we put up with having to watch Jamie and Cersei, Jon and Ygritte, Jon and Dany, Drogo and Dany get it on.  You can return the favor and put up with seeing a couple of women occasionally get it on without complaining, okay?

And know what I found out when I looked for that sexy scene between Dany and her handmaid? 

This

Do you see my point?  Maybe I don’t always like writing explicit sex scenes, but I get why Our People sometimes feel like they need to have them.


8 Comments

Pat O'Hara · December 9, 2018 at 4:39 pm

I understand your feelings about explicit sex scenes, however I understand why we readers tend to lean more to the books written with the sex scene in them. I read both types of stories. At the age of 70 and having lost my partner of 35 years 6 years ago I find the sex scenes bring back the good times , like when she returned from Korea 3 months after I had returned. Guess what we did for the month she was on leave? And yes I’m a lesbian and enjoyed sex with my partner I don’t find the sex scenes offensive. I find they bring back wonderful memories of our time together. So please give me a great storyline and even a faded romance so I can continue having my fond memories.

Janet Logan · December 9, 2018 at 5:17 pm

FWIW: While I do sometimes enjoy the explicit sex scenes in lesfic, as a demisexual lesbian, I don’t feel they *must* be in a given book for it to be lesfic. Other than that slight difference of opinion, I understand and mostly agree with your post. I know, I’m one of throngs of lesbians. Take the above for all that it’s worth. 😊

katrin · December 10, 2018 at 11:40 am

I would understand when in a mystery or a thriller is no sex or less sex but in a love story i want them to get real close . Because if it is written good it makes you feel like if it is real . As if you are in the story and feel it yourself. Not only the tension but the love. If it is written good i gives us the opportunity to feel real love . And with real love comes of course the heart and mind shattering , never before experienced , soul- bounding Orgasm . But of course without that it would be still a really good book .About two really good friends.Don`t we have enough of that. Please don`t take away my lesbian lovemaking books . With multiple orgasms every now en then .Please?? Greetings from the Netherlands.

Bugs · December 10, 2018 at 1:13 pm

Totes agree with your points. Yup, for some reason, when “lesfic” is mentioned, people automatically expect sex. Perhaps lesfic started off publishing romance only? I, for one, first and foremost, want a well-written and structure story with intriguing plots and fascinating characters. When characters are phenomenally written with multi-dimensional aspects of their life, personal or professional, with a solid storyline, sex is an icing on the cake for me. Same goes for me when reading “mainstream” fiction, exclusively the crime/thriller/mystery/paranormal genres. This is because, in these genres, most of the time, there’s no time to develop any kind of sex, really. Yes, most of them in these genres have relationships. But not usually including sex and when they do, they’re very vanilla. And I certainly do not welcome any explicit sex scenes in these genres in mainstream fiction. So, naturally, I do not expect to read explicit ones in lesfic either. BTW, isn’t “lesfic” or “lesbian fiction” fiction with lesbians, meaning non-het fiction? Why, in this day and age, do people still equate homosexuality (lesbians or gays) with sex as a default, and not heterosexuality? It’s frustrating that even those in our community also think that way. Societal conditioning, perhaps?

Anyway…. back to explicit sex scenes – now, I’ve never (and never will) read mainstream romance (meaning, straight) because I never wanted to subject meself to reading M/F sex. But I definitely expect sex scenes in lesfic F/F romance, though. Only because it’s romance and sex plays a vital role in telling a fully fledged love story between two people as it enhances and deepens the emotional level of the characters when expressing intimacy and love for each other (or sometimes lust). Just like in mainstream romance books, they’re inundated with explicit sex scenes – e.g. Mills & Boon, Harlequin, etc… books, so I’ve been told. So, I would raise me eyebrows if I don’t see sex (or *gasp* fade-to-black!) in a F/F romance in lesfic. Being explicit has different levels, though – mild, middle-of-the-road, strong. One can actually identify which authors write mild/vanilla ones, and which ones are guaranteed to give their readers real explicit ones. I’m ok with all of them, depending on what kind or romance the author is trying to tell. But I’m not ok with fade-to-black romance because it takes away that intensity of the intimacy when the love story progresses to an emotionally (and sometimes physically) deeper level of the relationship. That’s just me personal preference, really. Also, I used to think “explicit” means “erotic.” That’s why there’s romance and then there’s erotic romance. So, I never expected a bog-standard F/F romance to necessarily have “explicit” sex. But then nowadays, the line between standard romance and erotic romance is blurred significantly, innit? But I still have a certain expectation when I choose to read an erotic romance vs a standard f/f romance. One, I expect explicit and the other I expect sex but not necessarily “explicit” per se, as long as it’s not fade-to-black. Anyway, that’s me 2 cents.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts about this topic which I think is a hot one to debate/discuss amongst lesbians/wlw readers/writers. Another thing I wanna mention is: if an author feels “obligated” to include a sex scene, not on her own volition, then wouldn’t that sex scene be somehow inauthentic to the story/characters? Maybe I’m naive, but I’d like to think that when I read a sex scene (explicit or otherwise), the author wanted to write it (with her heart in it) and not being forced to because of pressure or expectations. I’d rather they don’t include it if they don’t want to and focus on making the characters so compelling that the absence of sex (there are many creative ways to portray intimacy, sensuality, eroticism besides the act itself, aren’t they?) isn’t really an issue, provided that there’s still some intimacy (even just hand-holding, longing glances, etc) included or it wouldn’t be romance, would it? I dunno. Sex is such a personal, private matter, innit?

Janice Best · December 27, 2018 at 10:07 pm

Oh, pooh. Now that I know you don’t enjoy it, I won’t enjoy the sex scenes in your stories as much. J/K. Kinda.

More importantly, I think it sucks that you and other lesfic authors have to go through this. Whatever the reasons, reasonable and otherwise, it sucks.

I would “expect” sex scenes in lesfic romances. I appreciate them in other lesfic genres. Although I’ve read some that are just all sex, and some of those (not all of them!) have been a bit too much. (And if one or both main characters in a lesfic romance are asexual, I would not expect sex scenes, or at least not as many, but it would be interesting to read stories where asexual folks and their partners navigate sex.)

I’m curious as to who is the author of the mystery series where her MCs had no sex the first story, and were nowhere near each other in a later story. Anne Hagan? I *love* her stories! She also tries to straddle the line between queer audiences and straight audiences. When I read her stories, I know to not expect tons o’ sex. So I am more likely to read them after I’ve read a number that have “too much” or “too soon” sex. (“Too much” and “too soon” in my mind, whether or not anyone else agrees with me.)

Maybe, just like there are “warnings” about sex scenes, there should/could be “warnings” about no sex.

    Anne Hagan · January 3, 2019 at 2:48 am

    You’ve got me, Janice. I was the mystery author Eliza was referring to.

    Sadly, this conversation comes up often. I’ve had it or seen it in multiple Facebook groups, heard it come up in panel discussions at two different GCLS conferences (2017 in Chicago and 2018 in Las Vegas), I’ve blogged about it myself, my good friend and fellow author Barbara Winkes guest posted about it on my blog, and other authors have blogged about it too. The consensus always is, the sex should make sense and fit the story, but that many/most WLW readers expect us to write stories that naturally include sex. It matters not that mainstream stories in genre fiction don’t include it.

    If we, as authors, write exclusively for the tastes of a lesfic audience, we risk never being able to reach a much broader audience for our work. If we write for the 95% of the fiction market that doesn’t read WLW fiction, but is not adverse to LGBT characters, we upset our most loyal readers. I’d call this a ‘catch-22’ My mother would say, “You’re damned if you do, and damned if you dont.”

      Pat O'Hara · January 3, 2019 at 1:14 pm

      I must be in the minority as I have read a few lesfic books
      That did not include steamy sec scenes. Recently I read the book by Harper Bliss and her wife about a tennis pro and her friend that turned into a lover. The sexual encounters between them was only insinuated at. The scenes were not actually written just implied. What is wrong about a person having to use their imagination? The author actually have to write a better storyline to be able to capture the imagination of the reader. I still get the feeling of enjoying a good sex scene, however a great writer can convince the reader that the sex scene that was or had happened was in their story telling. I know a lot of people just want sex but I for one prefer it to be making love instead of hot sex every without a good story.

Kisha · August 12, 2024 at 5:37 pm

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